[Regina]

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

They did. But his rules of engagement on the UN is something I actually appreciate with this government. The UN--well, in particualrly the General Assembly--is prone to frequent bouts of dingbattery, so limiting exposure and engaging on specific terms is a good idea, in my books.

[bootlegga]

Thanos Thanos:

I no longer see any prestige value in being involved in any of the UN's activities, at least not as long as vile dictatorships have an equal voice along with those of legitimate democracies. Having some fawning members of the diplomatic corps telling us on the CBC that the others "like us, they really really like us" is totally irrelevant to me.

Sorry, but that is bullshit.

The UN has always had vile dictatorships in it - the difference is that those that exist today aren't willing to be bought with 'aid packages' the way those of the 1950s, 1960s, 1970s, etc were. The big difference is we no longer outnumber the poor nations of the world and cry about our loss of power just lie the GOP south of the border.

No, they told us to shove it and in response, we've declared the UN 'worthless'.

This attitude is no better than the kid who grabs his ball and goes home after he isn't chosen captain of the street hockey team.

[herbie]

And we're all going to blame the 3rd world for the decline of the UN because we no longer get what we want, eh?
No it sure isn't as effective as it once was when the US, Britain and Canada could produce a statesman instead of a puppet for the bean-counters. Anyone dumb enough to compare Kissinger or his predecessors to the featherwights since? Or in our case even since the Mulroney days?
Forgotten Canada's significant role on apartheid already?
There's a major difference now that there aren't two opposed blocks and the non-aligned 'third world' isn't so insignificant anymore. So we first worlders better learn to adapt and relearn the game of diplomacy.
And the G20 isn't more important. It's a totally different organization with a totally different role.
NATO has become the only thing differentiating the current UN from the League of Nations... the Big Guys Will Act if it's in our declared sphere.

[ShepherdsDog]

Anyone who has worked with or for the UN knows that the average worker is a decent human being trying to help others. It's the higher ups and mid level admins that are useless pieces of shit who do more harm than good. I have absolutely no respect for it as an organization.....and yes, it's gotten worse for corruption and inefficiency with more third worlders running things. They use the UN to pad their pockets.

[2Cdo]

ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:

Anyone who has worked with or for the UN knows that the average worker is a decent human being trying to help others. It's the higher ups and mid level admins that are useless pieces of shit who do more harm than good. I have absolutely no respect for it as an organization.....and yes, it's gotten worse for corruption and inefficiency with more third worlders running things. They use the UN to pad their pockets.

Well said. The UN started with plenty of ambition and meant well, but sadly those days are gone.

[saturn_656]

bootlegga bootlegga:

No, they told us to shove it and in response, we've declared the UN 'worthless'.

This attitude is no better than the kid who grabs his ball and goes home after he isn't chosen captain of the street hockey team.

Damn right we're taking our ball and rightfully so, but we aren't going home. We're aiming to play with more worthwhile players on better streets.

[bootlegga]

saturn_656 saturn_656:

bootlegga bootlegga:

That's just it - in the G20 and other mid-sized organizations, we're the runt 'o the litter. At least in the UN, we can claim 'middle power' status.

We're the 11th largest economy in the world (and of the G20), so when it comes to the G20 (Group of 20 Major Economies) we are still middle of the pack.

The runt of the G20 litter would be South Africa. Our GDP is larger than South Africa's, Argentina's, and Saudi Arabia's GDP combined.

Some runt eh?

$1:

If we sat on the Security Council, our voice might actually be heard when we talked about Iran, Syria or North Korea - instead, virtually nobody cares what we say on those issues (and many others) - even in friendly places like NATO or the G8.

Yeah, shame we didn't get a real Security Council seat like the rest of the Allies did. Must not have bled enough for the cause.

Getting a rotating council seat is like sitting at the kiddie table at thanksgiving.

We may rank in the middle of the pack in some statistics in these organizations, but when you add everything up together, we are ranked near the bottom of most organizations we participate in - simply because we are dwarfed by much larger and more powerful nations (USA, UK, Germany, France, Japan, Russia, China, etc).

I doubt our influence in a lot of these organizations is substantially larger than Saudi Arabia or South Africa - despite having a larger economy. I'm sure we have more influence - but its 15% instead of 10% like those nations have.

[saturn_656]

bootlegga bootlegga:

saturn_656 saturn_656:

bootlegga bootlegga:

That's just it - in the G20 and other mid-sized organizations, we're the runt 'o the litter. At least in the UN, we can claim 'middle power' status.

We're the 11th largest economy in the world (and of the G20), so when it comes to the G20 (Group of 20 Major Economies) we are still middle of the pack.

The runt of the G20 litter would be South Africa. Our GDP is larger than South Africa's, Argentina's, and Saudi Arabia's GDP combined.

Some runt eh?

$1:

If we sat on the Security Council, our voice might actually be heard when we talked about Iran, Syria or North Korea - instead, virtually nobody cares what we say on those issues (and many others) - even in friendly places like NATO or the G8.

Yeah, shame we didn't get a real Security Council seat like the rest of the Allies did. Must not have bled enough for the cause.

Getting a rotating council seat is like sitting at the kiddie table at thanksgiving.

We may rank in the middle of the pack in some statistics in these organizations, but when you add everything up together, we are ranked near the bottom of most organizations we participate in - simply because we are dwarfed by much larger and more powerful nations (USA, UK, Germany, France, Japan, Russia, China, etc).

I doubt our influence in a lot of these organizations is substantially larger than Saudi Arabia or South Africa - despite having a larger economy. I'm sure we have more influence - but its 15% instead of 10% like those nations have.

Those big countries would dwarf us in the UN too, plus we don't have a chair in the one UN body that actually counts for something.

[Jabberwalker]

$1:

We're the 11th largest economy in the world (and of the G20), so when it comes to the G20 (Group of 20 Major Economies) we are still middle of the pack.

The runt of the G20 litter would be South Africa. Our GDP is larger than South Africa's, Argentina's, and Saudi Arabia's GDP combined.

Some runt eh?

Our economy is bigger than Russia's (with a quarter of their population) and look at their international footprint. Perhaps, if we were a bully as well, ...

[Jabberwalker]

$1:

Well said. The UN started with plenty of ambition and meant well, but sadly those days are gone.

The U.N. was born out of high ideals but it has been hijacked over the years by assholes like Castro, Ghadaffi, Arafat ... the self-declared "non-aligned" who had their own axes to grind.

[Thanos]

When is the annual UN "Death to Israel" vote scheduled for this year?

[saturn_656]

Jabberwalker Jabberwalker:

$1:

We're the 11th largest economy in the world (and of the G20), so when it comes to the G20 (Group of 20 Major Economies) we are still middle of the pack.

The runt of the G20 litter would be South Africa. Our GDP is larger than South Africa's, Argentina's, and Saudi Arabia's GDP combined.

Some runt eh?

Our economy is bigger than Russia's (with a quarter of their population) and look at their international footprint. Perhaps, if we were a bully as well, ...

Russia leads us these days but not by a huge amount.

In real economic terms they are on par with Italy, but they spend a relatively large amount of cash on their military.

[Jabberwalker]

$1:

In real economic terms they are on par with Italy

Fortunately, our economy is built on a much more varied foundation than Italy's.

[commanderkai]

Thanos Thanos:

When is the annual UN "Death to Israel" vote scheduled for this year?

I think they're on their 23rd or 24th.

[saturn_656]

Jabberwalker Jabberwalker:

$1:

In real economic terms they are on par with Italy

Fortunately, our economy is built on a much more varied foundation than Italy's.

May not be long before we surpass Italy. Our GDP is still slowly growing while theirs is shrinking.